[Ponte Alto] WMA and the SCA

[Andrew Grey]

Hello all,

	This just sparked my interest.


> Secondly, how is the SCA going to look, if we cannot demonstrate 
> a DOCUMENTED,
> PERIOD line of study, and we have to pass it off to a living 
> history group to
> do? We look bad to the school when we say "We're sorry, this is 
> too period, and
> we don't have all of the proper forms and waivers relating to our 
> method of
> combat, even though this study has little to do with our SCA 
> sport combat".

Playing the Devil's Advocate here: Would it not make more sense, in the short term, to in fact pass it off (the Fiore et al part only) to a LH group if that is a better way to educate the kids?  Until we in the SCA figure the proper way to incorporate the WMA into our ranks it seems to me that this is a viable alternative.  The kids don't know, and I'll bet don't care, who is SCA and who is LH.  Remember to them, we are all LH!  :^)  The don't have the trained bias of who is more period and what is more period.  And frankly most of the items and stuff that PA fields at demos is equal to any LH group. 

Sorcha has done a *bunch* of demos for schools and such. I know most all of our stuff easily passes muster for real medieval authenticity, much less for the for the LH criteria. ;^)

> 
> We ALSO look bad to the local living history groups, who already 
> often think
> that the SCA has no business educating children in a classroom. 
> All we're going
> to do by this is prove them right. 

Ok, I gotta ask... who really cares what they may or may not think?  If some of the LH groups think we are medieval neophytes, fine.  If they think we shouldn't be doing demos, fine.  Why should we feel that we must somehow prove ourselves to their standard?  I think they do some things better than we do, and to those things we should defer to them.  But as far as demos go, let me state again--no one at the demos, aside from us, is going to know the difference.  As long as we are presenting fact and doing it correctly there is not a problem.


> 
> There is a history here that some may not be aware of. There is a 
> history of
> talented people wanting to teach something, like Western Martial 
> Arts, in an
> A&S context, not finding much welcome within the SCA.


I'd love to know of where this specifically has happened.  If someone can give some real, first-hand examples, I'd love to hear them.  If this is occurring in our ranks, we should fix it.  The WMA folks can bring a new level of understanding and participation to the SCA.  I, for one, would encourage and welcome it!

As for the WMA being used in SCA combat, I love when they come out and do that.  I hope they can one day figure out how to make it work.


> Bureaucratic issues such as this, trying to lump a period 
> study of Fiore
> or Tallhoffer in slow forms in with full-speed rattan combat, 
> frustrate these
> people. 

The issues are not as much red tape as they are issues of modern insurance and liability.  This is especially true when we deal with children.  If some think we are too careful about that, I'm truly sorry for their lack of understanding of the SCA's position.  But having real steel around children can be fraught with problems.

Also keep in mind that the WMA has as a part of it's nomenclature the "M" which stands for "martial."  Hence the reason it is , as you say, lumped in with the full speed heavy combat.  Make perfect sense actually.  



>Instead of trying to change long standing tradition, they find it
> easier and more satisfying to leave, because what they're doing 
> is just TOO
> MEDIEVAL. 


"Too Medieval?"  I'd love a working definition of this.  :^)  (I kid... I kid...)


> 
> It may sound like sour grapes. It may sound like a case of "fine, 
> I'm taking my
> toys and playing elsewhere". But they've already *tried*. Look at 
> what Scott is
> trying to do - he's trying to enhance the study and reputation of the SCA,
> giving of his own time, something that he doesn't have to do. And when
> roadblocks are thrown up at every turn, when there needs to be a form or a
> waiver signed for everything, because somehow it *sounds* like it 
> might need
> it, I can't blame somebody for taking their toys away. And frankly, I (and
> others) think they're some of the coolest toys around.

Yeah, it does sound that way and that is unfortunate for both groups involved.  I know that the SCA tries to make everything we do accessable to all, but sometimes that must involve bureaucratic mumbo-jumbo to make it all legal.  We need to start working on including the WMA folks into our ranks.  I would love to try some of their "martial stuff" and see how it works.


> 
> Who is the poorer for it? The SCA.


No.  The kids we are trying to educate are the ones who are really missing out.  That is really sad, too.


Sir Andrew


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