[MR] Atlantia Digest, Vol 101, Issue 19

Sun Jun 5 15:57:26 PDT 2011

i apologize if i misunderstood you cassandra.  i would be happy to talk with
you off-list if you wish.

regards
logan

"I never did give them hell. I just told the truth, and they thought it was
hell." 
Harry S Truman 
"If an injury has to be done to a man it should be so severe that his
vengeance need not be feared"
Niccolo Machiavelli
For your SCA combat needs please visit:
www.ebonwoulfe.com/armory.htm

www.ebonwoulfe.com

For worldwide listings of fighter practices please visit:
www.fighterpractice.com

-----Original Message-----
From: atlantia-bounces at seahorse.atlantia.sca.org
[mailto:atlantia-bounces at seahorse.atlantia.sca.org] On Behalf Of Helen
Rogers
Sent: Sunday, June 05, 2011 5:41 PM
To: atlantia at seahorse.atlantia.sca.org
Subject: Re: [MR] Atlantia Digest, Vol 101, Issue 19

Perhaps a class in "Communication" is necessary... for everyone. Apparently,
we are back at square one... :(. I"m not going to elaborate, as I'll beat a
dead horse. As we all have seen, there are various ways to communicate, and
no one is correct. But, there are ways to get your point across without
offending.

 Cassandra

 Message: 1 Date: Sun, 5 Jun 2011 01:54:46 -0400 From: "Logan"
<Logan at ebonwoulfe.com> To: <atlantia at atlantia.sca.org> Subject: Re: [MR]
Egyptian Personas in the SCA Message-ID:
<000301cc2345$14612c50$3d2384f0$@ebonwoulfe.com> Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="us-ascii" actually i never stated anything of the sort. i never
said anything even close to calling you a liar, about hearsay, etc. i only
commented on the one thing you said which was you were treated in such a
way. i do find it odd that ive never met folks that were treated the way you
describe. never. but here is the thing. so, a new person finds the sca and
you suggest they come in, dress themself up in a certain way, never talk
with anyone beforehand, never meet anyone beforehand, they just show up. the
just show up wearing something that has no place in the sca. unannounced.
they somehow find the sca somewhere (on the web?), and they just wing it.
really? look, either they met someone in the sca who said "sure, yo  u can
wear that...... it will be fun" or they were the bravest of the brave and
said 'huh, look at this sca thing. i will figure out where the next event
is, then i will figure out what the costs are, then i will stop looking and
just make some garb." so they find the sca, decide they want to try it, and
somehow show up dressed like a steampunk whatever? does that make sense? you
claim to wish upon a pile of nickels for every person who did this. or did
they meet sca folk who said "do what you like, we dont mind?" see i want you
to help correct the problem. if they met sca folk that said "wear a maille
bikini" or "be a tuchux and dress like an extra from a road warrior reject
film" then met you and were upset that they were corrected (and didnt like
it, oh my!) you should sit them down and help them. if you tell them that
its fine, they should be upset, they should ignore the rules of the club
they CHOOSE to join, then you are wrong. i mean you claim to have met scores
of fo  lks that were told "you cant be an elf" and then claim its the fault
of the sca. that makes no sense. so yeah, i will compare the dozens of folks
ive met over the years (none of which simply found the sca on line and
figured out how to make it to an event, without ever speaking to a single
sca person, and dressed like a leather-clad pirate/road warrior reject by
the way) who needed some help and information to this plethora of folks you
state youve met that were treated poorly. who introduced them and told them
it was cool to be a doctor who character? did you figure that out and
correct that sca person? if it was just some internet intro why could you
not correct them without them feeling so downtrodden? you claim to have
salvaged "a few people" so where did they go wrong? either some sca folks
screwed it all up and told them "xena" is cool or they found the sca but did
no research and just showed up. either way, they are wrong. in the former
you clearly must have contacted
  the sca folks and corrected them...... right!? or, in the latter, you sat
them down and asked them how much of the enormous amount of information they
actually bothered to read and why they did what they did. i also find it
hard to believe that a totally new person would, as you suggest, just show
up and go all willy-nilly. again, ive interacted with many dozens of new
folks. and none of them fall into the categories you describe. regards logan
"I never did give them hell. I just told the truth, and they thought it was
hell." Harry S Truman "If an injury has to be done to a man it should be so
severe that his vengeance need not be feared" Niccolo Machiavelli For your
SCA combat needs please visit: www.ebonwoulfe.com/armory.htm
www.ebonwoulfe.com For worldwide listings of fighter practices please visit:
www.fighterpractice.com Message: 2 Date: Sun, 5 Jun 2011 02:22:34 -0500
From: Stefan li Rous <StefanliRous at austin.rr.com> To: Atlantia maillist
<atlantia at atlantia.sca.org> Su
 bject: [MR] Egyptian A&S entry, SCA boundaries (was Re: Egyptian Personas
in the SCA) Message-ID: <5D83E507-6CDE-4E73-B4A6-F4AFC3206C6B at austin.rr.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes ~Roh
said: <<< For those who have been following this thread...academically or
out of curiosity for Egyptian culture... please check out my A&S display I
plan to submit at War of the Wings. I strive to encourage those who are
willing to research and put themselves out there knowing they will be
judged. I wont say it's [not] easy but I hope that I can set an example...
grey area of SCA timeline or not...that others will feel the courage to
follow. >>> We've already corresponded on this subject via email, but I
wanted to publicly say good luck on your entry and to encourage you to
submit your A&S documentation for inclusion in the Florilegium. Or if you
prefer, write it up as one or more articles and submit it that way. As
you're learning, there isn't much mate  rial out there on Roman or medieval
Egypt. And this is a way to increase it, and to disseminate the knowledge
across the Known World. My standard policy is to accept updates at any time,
so you don't have to wait until it's "perfect" and you can improve it as you
learn more. As far as the SCA timeline, yes there are a number of grey
areas. It is because regions and time periods generally do not have easily
defined boundaries. So just when the SCA starts, and even when it ends, and
what regions it covers and doesn't cover is likely to vary from SCA kingdom
to SCA kingdom and from person to person. Again, because it is difficult to
set a sharply defined boundary. While you certainly have the right to push
your opinion on what is and is not period, try to keep in mind that one of
the key concepts of the SCA is courtesy and it is much more important than
authenticity. If it was the reverse, we would be a reenactment group, when
we aren't. Why 1600? Why not 1602 when Queen Elizab  eth died? Of course if
you are doing French or Serbian history, the death of Queen Elizabeth
doesn't mean much. The "end of the Middle Ages"? When exactly was the end of
the Middle Ages. It may have ended in Italy in the 14th Century on the
otherhand you could say it didn't end in Russia until the 18th Century. A
lot of A&S competitions will allow documentation published after 1600 to be
used. Just because the author, or someone else published in then, doesn't
mean the author didn't write it down originally much earlier, before 1600.
You have to consider how fast something was changing, knowing that
somethings might have changed abruptly in 1610, but many things didn't.
Actually this whole concept of "period" is fallacious. You really have to
ask period for where? Just because the Elizabethans were were fighting with
rapiers and drinking distilled beverages, doesn't mean that these items are
"period" for a Norman in England in 1125. Or just because coffee is period
for an Eg  yptian in 1500 doesn't mean it was period for an Englishman.
(Coffee didn't show up in England until 1650). Stefan -------- THLord Stefan
li Rous Barony of Bryn Gwlad Kingdom of Ansteorra Mark S. Harris Austin,
Texas StefanliRous at austin.rr.com **** See Stefan's Florilegium files at:
http://www.florilegium.org **** ------------------------------ Message: 3
Date: Sun, 5 Jun 2011 02:39:42 -0500 From: Stefan li Rous
<StefanliRous at austin.rr.com> To: Atlantia maillist
<atlantia at atlantia.sca.org> Subject: [MR] Northern Africa Message-ID:
<80AD643F-EE48-4CF9-910C-856F1CEE5601 at austin.rr.com> Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Logan said: <<< in
fact i personally was intrigued by the question being that my direct family
bloodline, well half of it, comes from northern africa. yes, im an african
american! ;8^) >>> You said you don't read collections of emails. So maybe
this won't be of use/interest to you. but here are a couple of files in the
Florilegi  um, that may be of interest. Africa-lnks (8K) 3/ 7/07 Links to
info on medieval Africa by Dame Aoife Finn of Ynos Mon.
http://www.florilegium.org/files/CULTURES/Africa-lnks.html Africa-msg (18K)
9/ 7/00 Africa during the Middle Ages.
http://www.florilegium.org/files//CULTURES/Africa-msg.html blacks-msg (80K)
1/16/05 Blacks in medieval Europe.
http://www.florilegium.org/files/CULTURES/blacks-msg.html Please understand
that I've never met or seen you, but I do understand that you might be
referring to just darker complexion than those deeper in Africa, but both
were known in Europe. Moors-msg (54K) 2/ 4/08 Culture and clothing of the
Moors. http://www.florilegium.org/files/CULTURES/Moors-msg.html
fd-Africa-msg (20K) 4/15/10 Period food of northern Africa.
http://www.florilegium.org/files/FOOD-BY-REGION/fd-Africa-msg.html Stefan
-------- THLord Stefan li Rous Barony of Bryn Gwlad Kingdom of Ansteorra
Mark S. Harris Austin, Texas StefanliRous at austin.rr.com **** See Stefan's
Flor  ilegium files at: http://www.florilegium.org ****
------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 5 Jun 2011 10:41:44
-0400 From: "Terri Morgan" <online2much at cox.net> To: "'Logan'"
<Logan at ebonwoulfe.com>, <atlantia at atlantia.sca.org> Subject: [MR] A story
Message-ID: <006901cc238e$b0d3cae0$127b60a0$@cox.net> Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I was reading the latest thread (as I should,
since I was involved) and the discussion reminded me of something I
experienced at Sapphire Joust last weekend. I was sitting under our baronial
pavilion by the list field when a young man came up to the front of it. He
was wearing cargo pants and a white tee shirt. I vaguely recognised him as
the same young man I'd earlier seen wearing a full set of chainmail over the
same clothes. He wanted to know if we were the group from around Portsmouth,
VA. I said we were, and how could we help him? It turns out that he had
heard about / read about the SCA online and had driven up to Sa  pphire
Joust to see what we did. It was his first event. "Oh wow! Really?! How
cool!" was the gist of the responses from the folks in the pavilion, after
which we told him about where and when we meet when not at events. Amid the
general discussion, he mentioned that he liked to make chainmail so when Syr
Otto came back to the pavilion, I hastened to introduce the young man to him
so they could talk about that (Otto has taught mail-making at a few of our
A&S nights). The young man left us to run to his car for his maille (how DO
you spell that?). He was from the same Command (he was active-duty) base as
Baron Mungoe, so one of our members hastened down to camp to tell Mungoe,
who was cooking dinner for the camp, about the guy and to see if Mungoe
could come up to meet him. An invitation to come visit camp and meet Mungoe
was quickly returned and the young man set off. He stopped by later on, as
he was heading for home, to say "hi" again and to let us know that we might
not s  ee much of him, as his wife wasn't interested in the SCA, but he
would certainly try to come out again. Had he met the rude "you're doing it
wrong" kind of people at Sapphire, we certainly would have never been able
to meet him. *Someone* talked to him and directed him to our pavilion. I
propose that we see many more "good experience" entries, at least, in the
SCA, than we do bad ones. Hrothny
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