[MR] Fwd: Re: Wootz Steel

[David Chessler]

At 10:27 AM 10/4/2007, Steven Chang wrote:
>Forgive my ignorance, but I thought Wootz iron ore is only available from a
>mine that no longer produced ore? I thought nobody knew the actual
>composition of the original Wootz iron and while the metal carbide banding
>pattern has been recreated, nobody knows if this is really the same Wootz
>since it was made a different way?

It is a technique of making steel, as I described. The original 
source of the ore had certain metallic "impurities" that also 
improved its properties. I think vanadium may have been among them. 
There is a scientific paper on the subject.
<http://www.tms.org/pubs/journals/JOM/9809/Verhoeven-9809.html>http://www.tms.org/pubs/journals/JOM/9809/Verhoeven-9809.html
http://www.oakeshott.org/metal.html

It would appear that the art was lost.

Damascus blades are often made for knives. The pieces of iron and 
steel are hammer-welded in a pattern and folded. The exact pattern 
and manner of folding determines the pattern on the finished blade, 
which is then enhanced by dtching. There are several techniques used, 
and Japanese techniques are different from western

The physical properties of the blade are also determined by tempering 
and by hammering which aligns the crystaline structure of the metal.

Most (not all) modern blades are made by grinding and stock removal, 
and so do not have the structure on the edge that helps keep it sharp.

There used to be many small forges in the south that smelted their 
own iron. Most of these have closed. Thus, it is very difficult to 
find hand smelted iron and especially charcoal smelted iron. Hobbyist 
forges may be a source, but they might not be interested in sales of 
the raw material.

If you are looking for a patterned knife, there are many makers of 
damascus knives, almost all of whom do custom work. It isn't wootz, 
but it is what was used for most of the SCA period, in most of the 
"known world." There are reports that, toward the end of the period, 
as trade resumed, wootz steel was no longer made, apparently because 
the original source, with the "impurities" was exhausted.





>On 10/4/07, Cecelia Hughes <hughescecelia at yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > Sorry, meant this to go to the list...
> >
> > Graidhne
> >
> > --- Cecelia Hughes <hughescecelia at yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Date: Thu, 4 Oct 2007 05:15:29 -0700 (PDT)
> > > From: Cecelia Hughes <hughescecelia at yahoo.com>
> > > Subject: Re: [MR] Wootz Steel
> > > To: David Chessler <chessler at usa.net>
> > >
> > > Ariadne the Flaxenhaired, who lives just over the border in Charles
> > > Town, West Virginia, has been smelting her own iron ore in her
> > > backyard.  She built the smelting furnace herself, and has done
> > > similar
> > > stuff at Pennsic.
> > >
> > > On the 20th of October, the Shire of Abhain Ciach Ghlais, justacross
> > > the Pennsylvania border in Aethelmearc, is hosting a Metalworkers
> > > Symposium.  The flyer I got suggested it would run from smelting ore
> > > through forge work, to jewelry making.  Well worth checking out.
> > >
> > > Graidhne
> > >
> > > --- David Chessler <chessler at usa.net> wrote:
> > >
> > > > At 12:00 AM 10/4/2007, Phillip Jones wrote:
> > > > >Is anyone in the Kingdom making Wootz or crucible, steel?
> > > >
> > > > Wootz steel was made by putting wrought iron into molten cast iron.
> > >
> > > > See Alex Bealer, The Art of Blacksmithing. p.38
> > > >
> > > > Wrought iron is no longer commercially available. What passes for
> > > > wrought iron is  low carbon steel. There was a swedish maker and a
> > > > british maker of wrought iron, but, so far as I know, both are no
> > > > longer in the business. In any event, they had not been exporting
> > > > much to the US. And the Euro is now at $1.42 so it would be
> > > > EXPENSIVE.
> > > >
> > > > Damascus steel was originally an imitation of wootz steel.
> > > >
> > > > Good luck.
> > > >
> > >
> > ========================================================================
> > > >                    The Merry Rose Tavern at Cheapside
> > > >     List Info: http://merryrose.atlantia.sca.org/
> > > >   Submissions: Atlantia at atlantia.sca.org
> > > > Subscriptions:
> > > > http://seahorse.atlantia.sca.org/mailman/listinfo/atlantia
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > 
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
> > > Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search
> > > that gives answers, not web links.
> > > http://mobile.yahoo.com/mobileweb/onesearch?refer=1ONXIC
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
> > Building a website is a piece of cake. Yahoo! Small Business gives you all
> > the tools to get online.
> > http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/webhosting
> > ========================================================================
> >                   The Merry Rose Tavern at Cheapside
> >    List Info: http://merryrose.atlantia.sca.org/
> > Submissions: Atlantia at atlantia.sca.org
> > Subscriptions: http://seahorse.atlantia.sca.org/mailman/listinfo/atlantia
> >
>========================================================================
>                    The Merry Rose Tavern at Cheapside
>     List Info: http://merryrose.atlantia.sca.org/
>   Submissions: Atlantia at atlantia.sca.org
>Subscriptions: http://seahorse.atlantia.sca.org/mailman/listinfo/atlantia