[MR] Your Women?

[E L Wimett]

Herveus probably knows that I have been SEETHING at this whole thread. 

A couple of years ago I was told by someone of some Atlantian households
that did not allow women to leave camp --- day or night --- unescorted by a
male at Pennsic and I said that was ridiculous.  

I STILL think it is ridiculous and extremely demeaning to all women.  It
implies that the women in question do not have enough discretion to make
their own decisions but must be guided by the males or other leaders of the
households in question.  I really had a hard time believing that the women
of those households, some of whom were intelligent, independent women
mundanely and some of whom armored up and fought in the lists, could so
abrogate their human rights for the approval of a single male or a group of
friends.  I STILL have a problem with that.

But then I also have a problem with males who assume that I cannot find
where the royalty are sitting in court and must be escorted to the front of
the hall.  As many of you know, I find that assumption demeaning and often
motivated less by "southern chivalry" than a desire to share the limelight.

It is one thing if someone --- male or female --- is scared enough to want
company at Pennsic or in court.  It is another to generalize and assume
everyone of a certain gender NEEDS it.

Alisoun, who has been walking the night at Pennsic since Pennsic IX

-----Original Message-----
From: atlantia-bounces at atlantia.sca.org
[mailto:atlantia-bounces at atlantia.sca.org] On Behalf Of Michael Houghton
Sent: Thursday, September 02, 2004 2:53 PM
To: atlantia at atlantia.sca.org
Subject: Re: [MR] Your Women?

Howdy!

On Thu, Sep 02, 2004 at 02:23:16PM -0400, Logan wrote:
> Jaine wrote:
>>
>> I'm picking at something that to many will be a nit, but to me it is a
>> significant statement. 
>> 
>> "Please, do not let your women walk unescorted after dark at Pennsic." 
>> 
>> I am not an object to be owned. I believe the phrase, "Please, do not
>> let anyone walk unescorted after dark at Pennsic." would be less
>> irritating to those of us who find the concept of 'ownership'
>> distasteful. If I seek or accept escort, it is because I am making a
>> decision about my own safety. Thank you for offering, I prefer not to
>> do you also dislike when someone refers to you when speaking to someone
else
>> as "one of your friends"?  it amazes me how easy it is for people to
allow
>> themselves to be offended.  glad i dont suffer from that.
> 
Aside from being a bit perturbed at the phrase "your women" conveying a
sense
of ownership, Jaine also suggested that the problem is not one of *women*
walking alone after dark, but a general "someone walking alone after dark"
concern. It's a general safety matter, not a gender-specific thing.

Speaking of "one of my friends" does not convey any sense of ownership, but
speaking of "one of my women" does have that subtly different connotation.
I don't see any suggestion of "evil" intent -- just a lack of care in
choosing
words.

I, too, was a bit perturbed at that phrase, sharing Jaine's concerns.

yours,
Herveus
-- 
Michael and MJ Houghton   | Herveus d'Ormonde and Megan O'Donnelly
herveus at radix.net         | White Wolf and the Phoenix
Bowie, MD, USA            | Tablet and Inkle bands, and other stuff
                          | http://www.radix.net/~herveus/

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