[MR] Authenticity (was pentograms)

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 Gwynwilf, my friend, you are mistaken in some of your assertions.

1) I don't know about the intent of the founders of the SCA or those who ran the SCA in its earliest days. I wasn't around. I do know that early name submissions accepted Tolkein Elvish as documentation for registration. This is no longer the case. The organization has changed and grown ... which is why it still exists. Things that remain static die. Things that grow and allow change survive.

2) Pentagrams, as Lidia has shown, are period. They were a common Christian symbol. I have been told there is an entry in either Brechenmacher or Siebermacher (two valued Germanic heraldic rolls from period) of a device from period carried by a human being, not attributed to a literary figure that contains a pentagram.

3) Pentagrams are not universally offensive in the same way or at the same level as swastikas. Swastikas, by the way, are not registered in the SCA at all for this reason. No one sees a swastika in this post WWII time without thinking Nazis and Holocaust.

Pentagrams, on the other hand, have become accepted by many as a legitmate religious symbol to the point that the US Govt has accepted them for use on military grave markers. It is not widely seen as a Satanic mark.

4) You're right, we are not a religious or political organization...we don't dictate religion and it's never an official part of our organization. However it would be impossible to scrub all references of all religion from our organization.

We are an educational organization. This seems a good opportunity to educate the public, and by the looks of things, ourselves.

Your assertion that there is an agenda behind this change is flawed, also. I know the people who submitted the armory that challenged the precedent. I was there when the paperwork was processed at Pennsic. It was done in the assumption that in general fairness we (the College...the SCA) needed to change in recognition of changes in the real world that would allow something that is a period design and many in the SCA desired to use.

Wreath and many in the College agreed that the time had come. The change is done. 

>From the March Letter of Acceptances and Returns http://heraldry.sca.org/heraldry/loar/2009/03/09-03lar.html



Badge. (Fieldless) A mullet of five points voided and interlaced within and conjoined to an annulet azure. 





There
is a long history of rulings regarding the unregisterability of mullets
voided and interlaced (also known as pentacles or pentagrams),
beginning as early as 1973 by Ioseph of Locksley and including rulings
or correspondence in 1976, 1978, 1979, 1990, 1994, and 1996. The ruling
in 1990 was appealed to the Board of Directors, as reflected and
discussed on the April 1991 Cover Letter. As specified in that Cover
Letter, the primary argument against the registerability of this charge
was that "the device was not returned for its specific religious
content as perceived by the submitter and her co-religionists, but for
the specific anti-religious content as perceived by a far larger number
of people, both within and without the SCA." The 1996 ruling was an
appeal of a return from 1994, and after considering the various
arguments, the then Laurel King of Arms, Da'ud ibn Auda, felt
"compelled to uphold the prior precedents disallowing the registration
of mullets of five points voided and interlaced, whether within and
conjoined to an annulet or standing by themselves. [Based on the
evidence presented, s]uch charges still are perceived by a significant
portion of the population as [a] "satanic symbol", and hence cannot be
registered by the College." 






The current submission presents
extensive documentation showing that the pentacle or pentagram is no
longer perceived as a specifically satanic symbol. Instead, it has
become more closely recognized as a symbol of the Wiccan religion. For
example, the US military services have acknowledged the Wiccan religion
in their Chaplain's handbook since at least 1990, and, more recently,
the association of the pentacle with the Wiccan religion was
acknowledged by the US government when the pentacle became the Wiccan
religious symbol allowed on the government-furnished headstones of
fallen US soldiers.






We received a large amount of commentary on
this submission from the College, and the consensus was overwhelmingly
in favor of dropping the ban on this charge. We hereby overturn the
ruling from 1996, and allow the registration of mullets voided and
interlaced, both inverted and not, and both conjoined to annulets and
not, so long as the overall design in which this charge is used does
not otherwise violate RfS IX.2 Offensive Religious Symbolism.



This, in my opinion and that of many others though not all of course, is a reasonable step of growth.

People will perceive us in whatever way they are inclined. They usually don't get past the fact that we dress funny. We've had police involvement at Elchenburg Castle because some local folks have claimed we have been doing all manner of unsavory things at our events. 

We have no control over what people think and we're different from 'everyone' so they're going to think all sorts of things ... till we explain what we are ... which we've been doing at Elchinburg. It's the only response possible. Respect and Education.

~gise



 


 

-----Original Message-----
From: Baroness Gwynwilf <gwynwilf1wolf at yahoo.com>
To: atlantia at seahorse.atlantia.sca.org
Sent: Wed, Jul 22, 2009 4:11 pm
Subject: Re: [MR] Authenticity (was pentograms)

I









As I stated before, 
1.the sca has tried to keep all religion out of the sca since it began.
2.pentagrams are not period 
3.they are offensive to most of the population, like the swastika. 
4.Last time I looked, the SCA was neither a religious organization, or a 
political one.