[MR] FW: 4th Peerage

[morgul at sc.rr.com]

I'd just like to chime in slightly as a newcomer.  

Coming into the sca, I have no  expectations of any kind of accolades  or awards.  I am interested in heavy fighting, but know that the odds are against me ever getting far in a tournament, much less eventually becoming a knight.  I simply don't have the time or ability to become a great fighter.  I understand this and accept it.  Once I get armored, I will simply get on the field and do the best I can.   I have gotten into archery and have enjoyed the 2 competitions I've been in.  I have no expectations from it as well.  I step up to the line, and do the best I can. 
I am also getting into heraldry.  It looks like fun, so I'm going to try my hand at it. 
I don't look for accolades or awards.  It would be nice to be recognized for achievements, but as long as I am having fun, I'm  good.

As I mentioned, I'm new to the sca, so I'm not sure exactly how things are done.  I don't know if people wander around and watch the rapier and archery fields or not.  If they don't, they should.  Like the heavy combat, each group has fun and is enjoyable to watch.  If you've never heard 20 archers release their arrows at the same time, and hear not only the flight, but the impact of multiple arrows, it's an awesome sound. 

I guess my point in this is that maybe we need to step back and look at why we do this.  I'm here to have fun.  Not collect awards and power.  if I get my aoa sometime in the future, that'll be cool.  If I get nothing else, so be it.  As long as I'm participating and enjoying myself,  that's all the reward I really need. 

I have been reading the comments on a 4th peerage.  I can see both sides of the issue.  I don't have the background or experience to really comment on the issue.  I  just wanted to give my  rambling input and pov, and  just urge everyone to keep things in perspective. 

Going back to lurk mode now...  

- Cian mac Cellachán Uí Dubhlaoich

(mka Craig)

Sent from my BlackBerry® smartphone with SprintSpeed

-----Original Message-----
From: "Chris and Sue" <amceagle at bellsouth.net>

Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 12:59:20 
To: <atlantia at atlantia.sca.org>
Subject: [MR] FW:  4th Peerage


So, for the sake of discussion (not necessarily my own opinion), why not
knight a non-heavy fighter?  I might be mistaken, but if all it takes is an
"advanced knowledge of the forms of combat in the SCA" (and this quote may
be wrong, check for yourself), then it seems the reigning king could do so.
I'm not saying it would be a wise idea, but that it could happen.  Would it
damage the Knighthood image to allow other disciplines the white belt?

In my mind, a knight is inherently an armored combat fighter (okay, now this
IS my opinion).  What's the argument against other disciplines though,
besides the "off-the-cuff" it's easier than heavy.  I fenced, briefly, a
long time ago, and found it enjoyable, fun, and (yes) easy compared to the
road I'm taking as a heavy fighter.  I'm not claiming to have been
white-scarf good, but I was able to hold my own against the opponents at
that particular event.  I'm almost certain that the discipline has advanced
far afield since that time, so my opinon is most likely horribly out of
date.  Perhaps I'll try it soon and find myself with a multitude of little
dot-bruises all over my body.

The game we play, as much as we would like to make it so, is not a true to
the Middle Ages game.  We have far too many Arthurian Romance ideals (not to
mention Hollywood inspired ideas) to claim to be accurately and truly
representing the Middle Ages. I've seen those guys, and they're all one
period, they're all amazing at what they do, and there's no way I'm camping
in my authentic lean-to using authentic tools to eat my authentic dinner in
my authentic clothes.

So, I guess what I'm saying as a non-peer, non-royal participant in the game
we play is: show us the arguments for, or against.  Simply "They work just
as hard" isn't necessarily enough.  I know a lot of people who "work really
hard" and who don't have peerages yet.  It's not always because they're not
doing the right things.  Sometimes, it's just becaue they're not being a
peer before they're made a peer (this is NOT an accusation - if you take it
as such, you're a thin-skinned ninny), or they are flying below the radar.
We all want to be in the club where the cool kids are hanging out, but if
the club doesn't fit, should we force our way into it?

White scarves are currently a grant-level award to recognize grant-level
achievement (The Honorable Lord/Lady).  This places them on par with the
Order of the Kraken (and other combat orders of which I am too lazy to look
up at the moment).  Personally, I think Krakens are pretty damn cool, and
maybe one day, I'll be inducted.  Maybe one day, I'll be a Knight.  If I
break somewhere along the way and can no longer heavy fight, there are two
other peerages that would love to have me (provided I'm just that bad-ass,
which of course I am).  They are equal to knighthood, and just as important.
Being a Laurel or a Pelican doesn't mean you're less-than a knight.  It
means you're equal.  There is (from what I see) far more academia involved
in rapier combat (research, styles, historical masters, etc) than there is
in armored combat (armor, weapons, weapons, armor).  So perhaps, one day, if
there's not already, there will be a FENCING LAUREL.  See, peer.  Peer for
your discipline.  Master/Mistress vs. Sir/Dame = tie.  There are ways to
legitimize what you do without creating a fourth peerage.

So, to sum up, what are the arguments?  Why make a fourth peerage?  Why not
incorporate into another peerage?

-If I'm wrong, and 100% off base, a simple "Dagobert, you're an ass and shut
up" works by me.

Dagobert

-----Original Message-----
From: atlantia-bounces at atlantia.sca.org
[mailto:atlantia-bounces at atlantia.sca.org]On Behalf Of Marybeth Lavrakas
Sent: Friday, February 20, 2009 12:28 PM
To: atlantia at atlantia.sca.org
Subject: Re: [MR] 4th Peerage




If this were my beloved 16th C England rather than my beloved modern
Atlantia, those men owning property worth more than L40 per year would be
required to take up knighthood. Another good way was to become a lawyer,
then buy a place. Of course, some folk would also pay fines to AVOID being
made to be a knight, not because of any military connotation, but because of
the financial costs associated with properly maintaining the dignity of the
rank.

And in late period France, there was a great deal of selling of knighthoods
to eager buyers. It's been far too long since I read French history in
depth, but I'm thinking there was a 'nobility of the robe' versus a
'nobility of the sword'...

Kateryn Rous
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