[Archers] Crossbow stock rule interpretation

[Siegfried]

> Nope. I washed out. All the stocked crossbows I could find in my two
> books were at least 17th century. Most were more modern and some even
> had triggers. I am willing to go with Siegfried on the example I cited
> as being at least 17th century.

*nod*  That matches my research as well.   You can find some crossbows
where the shape starts to change a bit, become shorter, wider at the
back, with a 'slope' for the head, near the end of the 16th century.
But it still doesn't resemble a modern rifle stock.  Instead, it's
looking more like a cross between a traditional 'western european' style
crossbow, and a period firearm.

> I think I see the reason medieval crossbows didn't have rifle-type
> stocks. Most of the medieval crossbows in my books shown being cocked
> has the butt braced against the archer's stomach, and so the ends are
> blunt. You can't have a pointy musket-style stock poking the archer in
> his tummy, even if he is wearing a gambezon and mail. On some later
> crossbows with narrower stocks, there is a large knob at the butt end,
> probably metal. All of the stocked crossbows shown in my books are light
> sporting models, and were cocked with a goat's foot or a built-in crank,
> so a horn-shaped butt like a 17th century musket wouldn't be an issue.

Right, well, or they were being spanned by foot, where you still don't
want a 'pointy' end in case it slips.  Or they are being spanned by
Windlass, where you need a 'flat' end for the windlass to attach.

The ones that 'start' to become rifle-like in appearance at the end of
the 16thcentury, tend to be cranequin based, where the loop would slip
over the crossbow and pressure fit, allowing the end to be whatever
shape it wanted.

Still not 'modern rifle' looking by any stretch though.

> The two (mostly) crossbow books I have in my library were not of much
> help, but do have some very interesting information on crossbow history
> and illustrations of various types:
> 
> Middleton, Richard. THE PRACTICAL GUIDE TO MAN-POWERED WEAPONS AND
> AMMUNITION. New York: Skyhorse, 2007. ISBN 9781602391475.
> 
> Payne-Gallwey, Ralph. THE CROSSBOW, ITS MILITARY AND SPORTING HISTORY,
> CONSTRUCTION AND USE. New York, Skyhorse, 2007. ISBN 9781602390102.

I don't have the first one.  But the second (THE CROSSBOW) is a staple
for those researching crossbows.

HOWEVER, be warned.  There are a number of inaccuracies in
Payne-Gallway's work that are semi-well known.  He did some 'interesting
things' to period crossbows (like soaking them in a bucket of water for
a month then shooting them and making random claims based upon that).

And he was notorious for 'guessing' about some things.  For example some
of his complicated 16th century mechanisms, he 'guessed' at the
internals on.  And he's been proven wrong.  Not only by the fact that
people tried to reproduce them, and they didn't work.   But because a
later author took the exact same crossbows and did Xrays of them,
showing exactly what the internal mechanisms are.

If you are interested in researching period crossbows, there are many
books with 'some info' in them here and there.  But the other BIG books
that you really want to seek out are:

* Die Armbrust by Egon Harmuth  (In German, hard to find)

* A Survey of European Crossbows by Joseph Alm (Produced by the Royal
Armouries, you can buy direct from them)

* A Guide to the Crossbow, by W.F. Paterson (Produced by the Society for
Archer Antiquaries, you can buy direct from them)

These three, plus 'THE CROSSBOW', make the somewhat definitive 4 of
medieval crossbows.   Beyond that, you find lots of books on medieval
weapons and/or archery, that have one or two pictures or pages with
crossbow information.

Siegfried


-- 
Barun Siegfried Sebastian Faust - Barony of Highland Foorde - Atlantia
http://hf.atlantia.sca.org/ - http://crossbows.biz/ - http://eliw.com/